I live in the Outer Richmond near Ocean Beach and 4 way stops don't mean a whole lot.
Down at the corner from where I live there is a very needed 4 way stop. Due to the houses and apartment buildings built at two corners, with a steep down hill and a cross street hill you can't see what is coming from the cross street until you are at the intersection plus the two down hills create extra speed.
Yet the necessity for stopping and needing to look did not stop a pickup from running the stop sign and almost picking me off as I walked across the street. The driver did not stop or slow down at all at the intersection and just blew through. Totally oblivious to the cross street traffic.
Traffic signs only work when people obey them or at least come to a rolling stop. The article in the pdf was quite clear removing the traffic signs and street paint directions and lanes was only part of the solution. The other part was limiting traffic speed to 20 mph or a little bit less. The reason? Someone hit by a car travelling less than 20 mph has a chance to survive. Cars travelling less than 20 mph also allows EYE CONTACT with the driver and other drivers and pedestrians and allows time for hand signals to cross over by the driver.
P.S. Privatized streets would have their own traffic control methodology or as the saying goes whatever the traffic will bear.
Justin Sampson <justin@...> wrote:
Here's a working model of my proposal for curb rights. Spontaneous order
There are several intersections in my neighborhood (Central Richmond
District) that I consider particularly dangerous because they are two-way
stops; cars in the un-stopped direction (including buses on a major Muni
route on our street, Balboa) pay no attention either to pedestrians or to
cars in the stopped direction, making it scary being a pedestrian or a
driver trying to cross. I witnessed an accident on Geary at another
two-way stop, where the traffic on Geary was completely uncontrolled,
making it impossible for someone to enter the intersection safely from the
cross street. My attitude has been that we should have four-way stops at
all of those intersections to make them safer, and my wife has lobbied for
a four-way stop at the intersection closest to our house; I had never
considered that *removing* the existing stop signs might have a better
They also briefly mention roundabouts, which I had a similar opinion of.
I used to work near a traffic circle at Townsend & 8th St. that I
considered rather scary both as a driver and as a pedestrian; but again it
had stop signs at every entrance to the circle, whereas proper roudabouts
have no stop signs, which apparently makes them *safer*.
But, Michael, what does this have to do with privatizing the streets as
you had described before? The article doesn't say anything about curb
rights, only traffic control. It doesn't even mention parking...
P.S. Here's the link to the article on the Web: