IMPORTANT - Rally to Support the Recount - Monday Dec. 6 (SF, noon)

Discussion
1

Thank you to Starchild for announcing the Dec 6 rally to promote legislation to ensure fairer political elections. Starchild also requests a resolution of the LPSF Executive Committee co-sponsoring this event. My vote is "no;" however, if all the other members of the Ex-Com believe that this event is a good investment of LP time and resources and vote "yes," I will in this case be happy to reflect the will of the majority.

As Starchild, Michael Badnarik, David Cobb, and all the other good people involved in this issue, I too would like to see everyone vote and every vote be counted; but I believe that there are sufficient means right now to promote good elections, without throwing more legislation, effort, and money at the existing problems: There are groups working to make electronic voting more transparent, there are means by which citizens can volunteer to observe elections to ensure fairness, there is legislation allowing citizens to request recounts, etc.

Marcy

2

Marcy,

  I appreciate your diplomatic stance, but I don't see how you can say that there are sufficient means right now to promote good elections. Do you think it's OK to have voting machines that have no paper trail that would let a vote be audited, and that it's OK to have voting machines with inadequate safeguards against being hacked into? Those are just a couple problems that exist now, and obviously the current efforts haven't been sufficient to fix it -- indeed the problems may be getting worse. And I don't think the authorities will be in any rush to admit things are screwed up and make a serious effort to fix them unless there there is a big stink about it and voting integrity becomes important to more people. That's a big part of what the recount is designed to accomplish -- generating that pressure for reform.

Yours in liberty,
        <<< Starchild >>>

Thank you to Starchild for announcing the Dec 6 rally to promote legislation to ensure fairer political elections. Starchild also requests a resolution of the LPSF Executive Committee co-sponsoring this event. My vote is "no;" however, if all the other members of the Ex-Com believe that this event is a good investment of LP time and resources and vote "yes," I will in this case be happy to reflect the will of the majority.

As Starchild, Michael Badnarik, David Cobb, and all the other good people involved in this issue, I too would like to see everyone vote and every vote be counted; but I believe that there are sufficient means right now to promote good elections, without throwing more legislation, effort, and money at the existing problems: There are groups working to make electronic voting more transparent, there are means by which citizens can volunteer to observe elections to ensure fairness, there is legislation allowing citizens to request recounts, etc.

Marcy

From: Starchild
To: LPSF Discussion List ; Bay Area Liberty ; Northern California Libertarians ; cal-libs@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2004 1:07 AM
Subject: IMPORTANT - Rally to Support the Recount - Monday Dec. 6 (SF, noon)

Can I get a vote of the LPSF Executive Committee to formally authorize
making our group a co-sponsor of this event, assuming the current
organizers agree? Strangely the Green Party isn't listed either, but
since Michael Badnarik and David Cobb filed this action, it seems to me
they would have a tough time saying no to representatives of either
party. We should definitely be out there with signs and the LP banner.

Let's show people that Libertarians are going to stand up and demand
fairness and transparency in elections, no matter who may benefit in a
particular case.

Please forward this message around to anyone who might go.

Yours in liberty,
<<< Starchild >>>

o/" "Have you been to a protest... lately?"

San Francisco Bay Area Independent Media Center
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Original article is at
http://www.indybay.org/news/2004/11/1707721.php

12/6: Emergency Rally to Demand Fair and Accountable
Elections and to Support the Recount

Monday, December 6th 12:00 Noon House Minority Leader
Nancy Pelosi 450 Golden Gate Ave., Burton Fed. Bldg.
San Francisco, CA 94102

Emergency Rally to Demand Fair and Accountable
Elections and to Support the Recount in Ohio
Monday, December 6th 12:00 Noon
House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi
450 Golden Gate Ave., Burton Fed. Bldg.
San Francisco, CA 94102

We insist that House Minority Leader Pelosi and all of
our representatives take immediate action to safeguard
the elections process. We demand draft legislation to
ensure: Minimum standards in the voting method
throughout the US.

An auditable paper trail for electronic and all voting
machines.

That all "spoiled" ballots and provisional ballots are
counted by hand and fairly.

To uphold and enforce the Voting Rights Act to prevent
the continued disenfranchisement of minority voters.

A complete investigation into how to revamp the
current processes to ensure fair and accountable
elections.

We urgently ask:

That House Minority Leader Pelosi join with Rep.
Conyers, Holt, Nadler, Scott, Watt, and Wexler in
demanding a Government Accountability Office (GAO)
investigation of the tens of thousands of reported
complaints regarding the 2004 election.

That Pelosi support the recount in Ohio being
performed on the behalf of the Green and Libertarian
candidates for president and the Nader Campaign's
recount in New Hampshire as a non-partisan effort to
ensure that every vote is counted.

That Pelosi support the Ohio Democratic Party in their
lawsuit to order Ohio Secretary of State Ken Blackwell
to impose uniform standards for counting provisional
votes on all 88 counties.

Cosponsored by United For Peace And Justice Bay Area,
Wellstone Democratic Club, The American Friends
Service Committee (Pacific Mountain Region), CODEPINK
Bay Area, the Ronald Reagan Home for the Criminally
Insane, Tikkun Community

more info http://www.reignoferror.com
www.reignoferror.com
------

Tony Bowles
CA Marijuana Party President
415-585-9228
tonebowles@...
http://california.usmjparty.com/

<image.tiff>

<image.tiff>

3

Starchild,
We all know the new touch screen voting machines suck. We all know
election fraud has, does, and will always exist. However, I am not
sure that as a Libertarian, I should be calling for the the big hand
of the Federal government to come and slap states into a universal
way to conduct their voting. How about citizens of each state get
involved in their voting process, from volunteering to observe
elections (as you did recently in the Governor's race), to
individually pressuring their representatives to require a paper
trail on the touch screen machines. (I do not mean to start an
argument on states' rights. Just trying to see if we can fix
problems with the resources we already have, without adding more
laws.)

Marcy

Marcy,

  I appreciate your diplomatic stance, but I don't see how you

can say

that there are sufficient means right now to promote good

elections. Do

you think it's OK to have voting machines that have no paper trail

that

would let a vote be audited, and that it's OK to have voting

machines

with inadequate safeguards against being hacked into? Those are

just a

couple problems that exist now, and obviously the current efforts
haven't been sufficient to fix it -- indeed the problems may be

getting

worse. And I don't think the authorities will be in any rush to

admit

things are screwed up and make a serious effort to fix them unless
there there is a big stink about it and voting integrity becomes
important to more people. That's a big part of what the recount is
designed to accomplish -- generating that pressure for reform.

Yours in liberty,
        <<< Starchild >>>

> Thank you to Starchild for announcing the Dec 6 rally to promote
> legislation to ensure fairer political elections. Starchild

also

> requests a resolution of the LPSF Executive Committee co-

sponsoring

> this event. My vote is "no;" however, if all the other members

of the

> Ex-Com believe that this event is a good investment of LP time

and

> resources and vote "yes," I will in this case be happy to reflect

the

> will of the majority.
>
> As Starchild, Michael Badnarik, David Cobb, and all the other

good

> people involved in this issue, I too would like to see everyone

vote

> and every vote be counted; but I believe that there are

sufficient

> means right now to promote good elections, without throwing more
> legislation, effort, and money at the existing problems: There

are

> groups working to make electronic voting more transparent, there

are

> means by which citizens can volunteer to observe elections to

ensure

> fairness, there is legislation allowing citizens to request

recounts,

> etc.
>
> Marcy
>
>
> From: Starchild
> To: LPSF Discussion List ; Bay Area Liberty ; Northern

California

> Libertarians ; cal-libs@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2004 1:07 AM
> Subject: IMPORTANT - Rally to Support the Recount - Monday Dec. 6

(SF,

> noon)
>
> Can I get a vote of the LPSF Executive Committee to formally

authorize

> making our group a co-sponsor of this event, assuming the current
> organizers agree? Strangely the Green Party isn't listed either,

but

> since Michael Badnarik and David Cobb filed this action, it seems

to me

> they would have a tough time saying no to representatives of

either

> party. We should definitely be out there with signs and the LP

banner.

>
> Let's show people that Libertarians are going to stand up and

demand

> fairness and transparency in elections, no matter who may benefit

in a

4

Marcy,

  I'm not calling for the federal government to get involved, and I haven't seen any such sentiment associated with the recount effort or even in the media generally. Reform should be encouraged at the state level. Not necessarily new laws, although new laws aren't always bad -- if a law was proposed that made it more difficult to raise taxes, I assume you'd support it. A law that made it harder to commit election fraud could also be a good thing, although of course it would require analysis.

Yours in liberty,
        <<< Starchild >>>