Dear Bruce,
May I respectfully submit that you've missed my point?
My point focuses on education exclusively.
It is simply that Judge Gray's advocacy of the state
taxing, regulating, distributing, and nationalizing the
distribution of marijuana fails to educate his audiences
regarding the libertarian message of free minds and
free markets.
Best, Michael
From: "brucedcohen" <brucedcohen@...>
To: "Dr. Michael R. Edelstein" <DrEdelstein@...>
Cc: "Starchild" <sfdreamer@...>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 7:44 AM
Subject: Re: [lpsf-discuss] Response from Judge Gray> Doctor Edelstein,
>
> I truly believe that Judge Gray is the best Libertarian candidate
California
> has
> ever had, since Ed Clark. Should he win the primary, he will get
more
> press,
> and positive press at that, than anyone has running with us, since
1980.
>
> I know that Jim isn't 100% pure Libertarian in some of his
answers,
but he's
> pure Libertarian in his core values. He's in love with the
Constitution,
> the
> Bill of Rights and understands what they mean and why they were
written.
>
> Some of the things he says are due to his being 'practical'. For
example:
> Taxing marijuana isn't a goal of his, it's just far better than
throwing
> people
> in jail for possession.
>
> I understand your feeling of wanting to support someone that's
principled
> and who won't move us away from our core values. Judge Gray is
that
> person. He's very enthusiastically supported by Aaron Starr and
Clyde
> Cleveland and Gary Nolan and Steve Dasbach, along with a host of
> other principled Libertarians.
>
> I'd like to ask you all to keep your options and minds open as
this
> important
> primary comes up.
>
> Judge Gray is the only one that will raise the million plus
dollars
needed
> to
> really take this election to the Demopublicans. He's willing to
take your
> calls,
> your advice and input. He's more directly involved than his
opponent ever
> was.
>
> And most importantly, he's someone that Californians will take
seriously.
> He's not a conspiracy theorist, promoting the idea that Israel
caused the
> September 11 Twin Towers attacks in New York, for example.
> (Gail did.) He's someone that is respected across the country and
get
> doors opened for the LP that we have only dreamed of.
>
> Please consider joining our team and influencing it.
> With you, we can do so much more.
>
>
> Bruce Cohen
> (949) 813-8001
> WWW.GetBruce.Com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: "Dr. Michael R. Edelstein"
<dredelstein@...>
> To: <lpsf-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
> Cc: <jimpgray@...>; "Anthony Gregory"
<anthony1791@...>;
> "Janice Edelstein" <Janice@...>
> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 5:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [lpsf-discuss] Response from Judge Gray
>
>
> > Dear Judge Gray,
> >
> > Thank you for your detailed response.
> >
> > The function of LP candidates running for high-profile
> > positions consists largely of educating the public about
> > libertarianism.
> >
> > Since the drug debacle is the focus of your campaign,
> > it is key you showcase libertarian solutions. These would
> > involve honoring individual freedom and property rights.
> > With respect to drug policy, advocating the govt getting
> > out of the drug business--lock, stock, and barrel--would
> > highlight our core values.
> >
> > Although your solutions may be a step in this direction,
> > I don't see them teaching the libertarian credo.
> >
> > As I mentioned to you at your talk, I admire your
> > courage in speaking out against the horrors of drug
> > prohibition. I hope and trust you will continue to do so.
> >
> > Best, Michael
> >
> > Michael R. Edelstein, Ph.D.
> > Clinical Psychologist
> > San Francisco
> > 415-673-2848 (24 hours)
> >
> > Author of THREE MINUTE THERAPY:
> > CHANGE YOUR THINKING, CHANGE YOUR LIFE*
> > (with David Ramsay Steele, Ph.D.)
> > FEATURES HELP FOR ANXIETY, DEPRESSION,
> > RELATIONSHIPS, PANIC ATTACKS AND ADDICTION
> > *A Quality Paperback Book Club/Book-of-the-Month Club Selection
> >
> > TO ORDER: www.ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
> > Or toll free: 1-800-986-4135
> > Email: DrEdelstein@...
> >
> > From: "Starchild" <sfdreamer@...>
> > To: "LPSF Discussion List" <lpsf-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 9:14 PM
> > Subject: [lpsf-discuss] Response from Judge Gray
> >
> >
> > >
> > > > From: jim <jimpgray@...>
> > > > Date: Tue Jan 20, 2004 8:36:55 PM US/Pacific
> > > > To: Starchild <sfdreamer@...>, James Gray
> > > > <jimpgray@...>
> > > > Cc: Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
> > > > Subject: Re: Your campaign for Senate
> > > > Reply-To: jim <jimpgray@...>
> > > >
> > > > Thank you for sending me your comments, and those from Dr.
> > Edelstein.
> > > > I always appreciate openness and direct discussions about
the
> > various
> > > > problems we are facing, and try to be forthright in my
responses.
> > > >
> > > > I believe in programs that work. In fact, I do not see
myself
as
> > a
> > > > "purist" in philosophy. However most of the time the
Libertarian
> > > > philosophy of individual liberty and responsibility, and the
most
> > > > reduced and local government possible to address the
problems,
if
> > in
> > > > fact government is necessary at all, is what works.
> > > >
> > > > This is demonstrated in my views about how we best should
proceed
> > with
> > > > regard to the drug issue. My program, as I tried to set
forth
in
> > San
> > > > Francisco, is to get the federal government out of the
business of
> > > > marijuana prohibition, and let each state decide how best to
> > address
> > > > the issue. Period. That is all I could officially
accomplish
in
> > > > Washington. Then, with regard to what I would lobby the
State
of
> > > > California to do, I would in some ways depart with the
Libertarian
> > > > philosophy and my support of the free market and liberty,
because
> > I am
> > > > so intensely opposed to advertising marijuana as the free
market
> > would
> > > > do, and should be able to do. I do not want to make
marijuana
> > > > attractive to children, and, in effect, to "push" it upon
them.
> > The
> > > > only way we can keep it from being advertised is for the
> > government to
> > > > take ownership of it -- with all of the defects that
entails.
> > > > Nevertheless, that is where I come down.
> > > >
> > > > Nevertheless, this would only be my suggestions to the
individual
> > > > states. If anyone had better ideas, they also could
advocate
and
> > > > lobby for their programs. If their ideas are more positive
and
> > > > workable than mine, I would embrace them. I am not proud; I
> > simply am
> > > > trying to come up with an all-around program to deal with
real
> > > > concerns. Since I have not seen any alternative
suggestions,
I
> > have
> > > > no information about anything better.
> > > >
> > > > This brings up a real difficulty in today's political life.
All
> > to
> > > > often, if people agree with eight out of ten positions
advocated
> > by
> > > > our elected officials, but disagree with the last two, they
have a
> > > > tendency to excoriate the office holder about the two upon
which
> > they
> > > > have a disagreement. As a direct result, politicians have
learned
> > to
> > > > be evasive, and even "wishy-washy." I am not that way, and
to
> > that
> > > > degree, I am not a politician. I understand that I am new
to
the
> > > > Libertarian Party, and that there are legitimate questions
about
> > this
> > > > "newcomer." However, as a judge, I have been forced to deal
with
> > real
> > > > issues, and real proposed alternatives. So to be blunt,
until
> > people
> > > > come up with concrete suggestions, as opposed to
non-constructive
> > > > sniping about the alternatives that are being suggested, I
am
not
> > > > impressed, and have nothing to respond to.
> > > >
> > > > So are your suggestions about this issue? How important is
it
to
> > you
> > > > that we reduce the glamore and pushing of these various
drugs
upon
> > our
> > > > children? What would you and Dr. Edelstein do about this
problem?
> > > > When you make suggestions, then we can talk further.
> > > >
> > > > Otherwise, in response to your other questions, I believe
that
> > > > government prohibitions simply do not work. I actually wish
that
> > they
> > > > would, but they do not. They do not work with regard to
drugs, to
> > > > guns, abortion, or prostitution, etc., etc. What works is
> > education,
> > > > individual liberty and responsibility. That is why I have
joined
> > the
> > > > Libertarian Party; that is why I have discovered that I have
been
> > a
> > > > libertarian all of my adult life.
> > > >
> > > > I may pass some of your "tests," and I may not pass others.
But
> > those
> > > > people who know me would tell you that I am approachable.
If
you
> > can
> > > > convince me on the merits of any issue, I am yours
regardless
of
> > where
> > > > the political winds are blowing. It sometimes takes courage
to
> > take
> > > > unpopular positions in the real world while the glare of the
> > public
> > > > spotlight is upon you. But if you look into my background
and
my
> > > > character, I believe that is one test that I have passed.
And
I
> > will
> > > > not change that for anyone for any reason.
> > > >
> > > > Our great country needs nothing less. We need principled
> > leadership,
> > > > which is grounded in Libertarian principles.
> > > >
> > > > I continue to request your support, and that of Dr.
Edelstein.
If
> > he
> > > > had concerns, I deeply wish that he had raised them to me
when
we
> > were
> > > > together in San Francisco. Hopefully, we will see each
other
> > again in
> > > > the near future, and if further questions remain, we can
discuss
> > them
> > > > openly. I actually enjoy an open discussion about these
things,
> > and
> > > > believe that I am not too old to learn and adjust to better
ideas
> > and
> > > > suggestions.
> > > >
> > > > In the meantime, I hope we can continue working together for
our
> > > > common goals, and continue to request your support.
> > > >
> > > > Judge Jim Gray
> > > >
> > > > From: Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
> > > > Sent: Jan 20, 2004 4:27 PM
> > > > To: James Gray <jimpgray@...>
> > > > Cc: Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
> > > > Subject: Your campaign for Senate
> > > >
> > > > Dear Jim,
> > > >
> > > > I haven't yet had the pleasure of meeting you in person, but
I'm a
> > > > libertarian activist in San Francisco who was delighted to
hear
> > that
> > > > you had joined our party and decided to run for office.
However,
> > as is
> > > > the case with many new Libertarians, especially those who
are
> > primarily
> > > > associated with a single issue, and emerge suddenly to run
for
a
> > > > high-profile position, there are understandably some doubts
as
to
> > the
> > > > depth of your commitment to the Libertarian Party and to the
> > philosophy
> > > > of non-aggression that we stand for.
> > > >
> > > > One skeptic is another local SF activist, Michael Edelstein,
who
> > saw
> > > > you speak recently. After reading his comments via email, I
asked
> > him
> > > > for permission to forward them to you for a response (see
below).
> > While
> > > > I have also heard positive things about your commitment to
> > libertarian
> > > > principles and am not assuming his impression is correct, I
> > decided to
> > > > raise the issue with you directly. I hope you will not take
> > offense,
> > > > but will see this as a chance to let more Libertarians know
where
> > you
> > > > stand, and that if you have differences with libertarian
beliefs,
> > that
> > > > you will be candid and straightforward about those
differences. It
> > may
> > > > be that I and others will decide to support you despite
> > disagreement on
> > > > some issues, but I always like to know as much as possible
about
> > who
> > > > I'm voting for, especially when faced with a contested
Libertarian
> > > > primary. Besides Michael's concerns, I've included three
questions
> > of
> > > > my own here:
> > > >
> > > > (1) Do you agree that involuntary taxation is theft? If the
issue
> > comes
> > > > up, are you willing to say so publicly?
> > > > (2) Do you feel the way about other victimless "crimes" such
as
> > > > prostitution, gambling, unlicensed entrepreneurship, non-use
of
> > > > seatbelts, polygamy, undocumented migration between
countries,
and
> > > > peaceful ownership of automatic rifles, the way I understand
you
> > do
> > > > about the "War on Drugs" -- that laws against these things
are
> > immoral
> > > > and unenforceable, and lead only to wasted resources, human
> > tragedy,
> > > > and loss of liberty? Will your campaign literature and
public
> > > > statements include support for the libertarian position on a
> > variety of
> > > > victimless "crimes" other than drug use?
> > > > (3) During your campaign will you strive to register new
> > Libertarians,
> > > > recruit party members, help other Libertarian candidates for
> > office,
> > > > and assist and promote the party wherever possible, and will
you
> > remain
> > > > an active party member after your campaign is concluded?
> > > >
> > > > Please get back to me at your earliest convenience, and feel
free
> > to
> > > > keep me informed of your campaign's needs and progress. I
may
well
> > be
> > > > actively supporting you, either before or after the primary,
and I
> > > > certainly wish you good luck in educating people about the
failure
> > of
> > > > Drug Prohibition.
> > > >
> > > > Yours in liberty,
> > > > <<< Starchild >>>
> > > > Outreach Director, Libertarian Party of San Francisco
> > > > Candidate for San Francisco School Board, 2004
> > > > Candidate for San Francisco Board of Supervisors, 2002
> > > > Candidate for State Assembly, 2001
> > > > Past Chair, Libertarian Party of San Francisco
> > > > Past At-Large Representative, California LP Executive
> > Committee
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >>> I heard Judge Jim Gray speak yesterday.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> In my view, he is an effective and credible speaker.
> > > >>> He certainly looks the part of a Senator.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Unfortunately, that's where my enthusiasm ends. He
> > > >>> is a Green on marijuana and a Republican on almost
> > > >>> everything else--a Greelican.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> His goal is to create another govt program: regulating,
> > > >>> taxing, and distributing pot in the form of a nationalized
> > > >>> govt monopoly. We'll have another DMV (Department
> > > >>> of Marijuana Venality).
> > > >>>
> > > >>> As a judge, he jails marijuana offenders on the grounds
> > > >>> that a judge should enforce the law, without regard to
> > > >>> its morality. (In all fairness to him, after his talk he
> > > >>> admitted to me that the Fugitive Slave Law was an
> > > >>> exception.)
> > > >>>
> > > >>> I'm puzzled as to why he decided to run as a
> > > >>> Libertarian, but thought it would be rude to ask him.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Best, Michael
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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