re: off topic; uncommon sSense career advice

jeanine_ring · September 1, 2004, 5:00pm

Dear Everyone - Definitely Off Topic - But Of Interest

We all seem to be John or Jane Doe working types of one kind or another. This blurb on careers which basically dumped on MBA's and lawyers and non - profit types for working at something they like - but at what price? Then followed some sage advice.

The author is Dr. Marty Nemko a local Berkeleyite with a PhD In Education

I saw therefore I share.

Ron Getty
SF Libertarian

As someone who really did come close to starving pursuing an academic carreer I loved
and who did lose five years of her life somehow trying to live as an independent philosopher, and could not make it work.. I still find this revolting to the bottom of my soul.

First of all, there's a difference in the pursuit of passion, prestige, and social service. The second
two, the social climbers and the do-gooders, I have no use for. But I am pained to see this
attitude towards artists, intellectuals, etc. by libertarians. Someone who gives up such a passion in
life for the sake of a 'practical' carreer is not my emblem of what freedom is all about.

What I hear is a conservative fear of 'intellectuals' a la Hayek, Schumpter, Kristol, Paul Johnson to match a socialist's fear of 'businessmen'. This war doesn't have to exist. I support businesspeople *because* commerce and industry can have the same passion as art, whether that business is Hollywood or plumbing supplies. If I thought capitalism *was* inherently an inevitable accpetance of dispirited compromise, I would seriously reconsider my support for it. As it is, I *am* a businessperson. On the ~very~ free market.

The lesson of Janis Joplin is the unfathomable cruelty of society that devours its best. She should
have just stayed in Texas and smothered her passion for music? 'Sound career advice'? Only
according to a standard of values that holds persistence in grey existence as better than a single bright flash.

I got my second choice in life, which I don't expect many people to understand, but which I am nevertheless proud. I love my life because I still live with passion and not 'practically'. What pain I have comes from not having been able to follow my first love. And even now, I have far more of my first love of idesa than I would ever have in 'practical' peace with the world.

"The choice was mine, and mine completely:
I could have, any prize that I desired
I could burn with the splendor of the ~brightest~~ fire-
Or else... or else I could choose time" (_Evita_)

Libertarianism should not be the politics of the grey leading the grey, urging the young to give up before they've tried, the place for the sold-out, the narrow, the weary, the tired, the cynical. Live such and believe in liberty if you much. I myself learned libertarianism from Rand, Shelley, and _the Dead Poets Society_. I followed my dreams, paid a price... paid the Price, and would do it again a thousand times.

If anyone young and thinking of giving up your dreams is reading this, then please hear me: from someone who survived, or at least mostly survived, don't give up, it's not worth it, and there are sometimes other paths. I made every blind and stupid dazzled assumption the young can make, but I would still rather have made those mistakes. The whiff of the tomb you smell in the middle-aged is real, it's not you, but they, who need to 'grow up'- humans do not gain wisdom by aging like wines. Adjustment is a tomb. What is here offered is a slow rot instead of a pyre.

"Do not let your fire go out, spark by irreplaceable spark, in the hopeless swamps of the approximate, the not-quite, the not-yet, the not-at-all. Do not let the hero in your soul perish, in lonely frustration for the life you deserved, but have never been able to reach. Check your road and the nature of your battle. The world you desired can be won, it exists, it is real, it is possible, it's yours." (_Atlas Shrugged_)

In this world, only death is certain. Even the smallest chance of passion is wise according the most sober and asult realization of them all: mortality. Any life you choose will see you cold in the end. Ask yourself what you would rather have died for.

To the old, in fact or spirit: I believe in your liberty to live as you want, even in stagnation, and do not love the altrusim and socialism that most idenitify with ideals and dreams. I have no carefor status- dare question me on this- nor do I despise commercial or unglamorous lives. But is "folow your dreams and starve" really what you want?

There must be a better way.

Jeanie Ring
'Jane Doe working type'

"If their lives were exotic and strange...
they would likely have gladly exchanged them
     for something, a little more plain;
     maybe something, a little more sane...
We each pay a fabulous price
for our visions of Paradise
but the Spirit...
               of a Vision...
                              is a Dream..."
- Rush, 'Mission'

lpsfactivists · September 1, 2004, 6:31pm

Thank you to Jeanine for the terrific response to Ron's equally great
career advice (as someone once said, we *are* blessed with great
writers in our group)! Sounds to me that as Libertarians we should
be supportive of whatever career choice anybody makes (except
government employee!), as long as the individual is ready to pay the
price associated with the less hum drum choices -- wheter that price
is starvation or 14-hour days. BTW Libertarians as a group seem to
be better known for their computer programing skills than their
artistic skills.

Marcy

--- In lpsf-discuss@yahoogroups.com, "Jeanine Ring"
<jeanie_ring@h...> wrote:

>Dear Everyone - Definitely Off Topic - But Of Interest
>
>We all seem to be John or Jane Doe working types of one kind or

another.

>This blurb on careers which basically dumped on MBA's and lawyers

and non -

>profit types for working at something they like - but at what

price? Then

>followed some sage advice.
>
>The author is Dr. Marty Nemko a local Berkeleyite with a PhD In

Education

>
>I saw therefore I share.
>
>Ron Getty
>SF Libertarian

As someone who really did come close to starving pursuing an

academic

carreer I loved
and who did lose five years of her life somehow trying to live as

an

independent philosopher, and could not make it work.. I still find

this

revolting to the bottom of my soul.

First of all, there's a difference in the pursuit of passion,

prestige, and

social service. The second
two, the social climbers and the do-gooders, I have no use for.

But I am

pained to see this
attitude towards artists, intellectuals, etc. by libertarians.

Someone who

gives up such a passion in
life for the sake of a 'practical' carreer is not my emblem of what

freedom

is all about.

What I hear is a conservative fear of 'intellectuals' a la Hayek,

Schumpter,

Kristol, Paul Johnson to match a socialist's fear

of 'businessmen'. This

war doesn't have to exist. I support businesspeople *because*

commerce and

industry can have the same passion as art, whether that business is
Hollywood or plumbing supplies. If I thought capitalism *was*

inherently an

inevitable accpetance of dispirited compromise, I would seriously

reconsider

my support for it. As it is, I *am* a businessperson. On the

~very~ free

market.

The lesson of Janis Joplin is the unfathomable cruelty of society

that

devours its best. She should
have just stayed in Texas and smothered her passion for

music? 'Sound

career advice'? Only
according to a standard of values that holds persistence in grey

existence

as better than a single bright flash.

I got my second choice in life, which I don't expect many people to
understand, but which I am nevertheless proud. I love my life

because I

still live with passion and not 'practically'. What pain I have

comes from

not having been able to follow my first love. And even now, I have

far more

of my first love of idesa than I would ever have in 'practical'

peace with

the world.

"The choice was mine, and mine completely:
I could have, any prize that I desired
I could burn with the splendor of the ~brightest~~ fire-
Or else... or else I could choose time" (_Evita_)

Libertarianism should not be the politics of the grey leading the

grey,

urging the young to give up before they've tried, the place for the
sold-out, the narrow, the weary, the tired, the cynical. Live such

and

believe in liberty if you much. I myself learned libertarianism

from Rand,

Shelley, and _the Dead Poets Society_. I followed my dreams, paid

a

price... paid the Price, and would do it again a thousand times.

If anyone young and thinking of giving up your dreams is reading

this, then

please hear me: from someone who survived, or at least mostly

survived,

don't give up, it's not worth it, and there are sometimes other

paths. I

made every blind and stupid dazzled assumption the young can make,

but I

would still rather have made those mistakes. The whiff of the tomb

you

smell in the middle-aged is real, it's not you, but they, who need

to 'grow

up'- humans do not gain wisdom by aging like wines. Adjustment is

a tomb.

What is here offered is a slow rot instead of a pyre.

"Do not let your fire go out, spark by irreplaceable spark, in the

hopeless

swamps of the approximate, the not-quite, the not-yet, the not-at-

all. Do

not let the hero in your soul perish, in lonely frustration for the

life you

deserved, but have never been able to reach. Check your road and

the nature

of your battle. The world you desired can be won, it exists, it is

real, it

is possible, it's yours." (_Atlas Shrugged_)

In this world, only death is certain. Even the smallest chance of

passion

is wise according the most sober and asult realization of them all:
mortality. Any life you choose will see you cold in the end. Ask

yourself

what you would rather have died for.

To the old, in fact or spirit: I believe in your liberty to live as

you

want, even in stagnation, and do not love the altrusim and

socialism that

most idenitify with ideals and dreams. I have no carefor status-

dare

question me on this- nor do I despise commercial or unglamorous

lives. But

is "folow your dreams and starve" really what you want?

There must be a better way.

Jeanie Ring
'Jane Doe working type'

"If their lives were exotic and strange...
they would likely have gladly exchanged them
     for something, a little more plain;
     maybe something, a little more sane...
We each pay a fabulous price
for our visions of Paradise
but the Spirit...
               of a Vision...
                              is a Dream..."
- Rush, 'Mission'

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tradergroupe · September 1, 2004, 6:33pm

Dear Jeanine;

You speak as someone who sounds like they ran into a speed bump or
two along the delightful, surprising, suspensful, twisting and
turning journey known as life. Should someone take the easy path or
take the road not taken?

As long as someone can continue to grow and not stagnant in the
pursuit of a Dream a Vision a Passion or has the chance to Dream of
having a Dream then they can have a life. Maybe not as fulfilling as
they would want it to be. Even if they do not achieve - at least
having had the chance to Dream of Achieving is some recompense.

As someone once said, " Hitch Your Wagon To A Star." And it does
not necessarily mean " Wish Upon A Star ".

The Robert Frost Poem says it best about diverging roads and which
is road is best the easy one or the one less traveled?.

Best Wishes on continuing The Success of: YOUR - SECOND CHOICE!!!

Ron Getty
SF Libertarian

1. The Road Not Taken

TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.