RE:Conservatve columnists and their notions.

Christendom is in the early phase of counter-attack against humanism,
culturally speaking

Indeed it is!

Free speech & press, freedom of religion, separation of religion from government and all the other values that the cartoon controversy are all about have been resisted tooth and nail by christianity over the last several hundred years.

That we have as much freedom as we do is in large part due to the efforts of, yes, humanists, over the last 400 years who were willing to demand these freedoms in the face of overwhelming and very often violent opposition and repression on the part of "Christendom". That they did so even without hope for divine reward is something that deserves our jaw-dropped respect and admiration.

I for one do not wish to be ruled according to anyone's gawd-given holy book and its self-appointed prophets.

For example, I was at a book reading the other night on "How the Pro-Choice Movement Saved America" And frankly I was shocked at what the pro-life movement is up to. The latest technique is to introduce laws into state legislatures to ban abortion-inducing pills and other such devices, in anticipation of the forthcoming overturn of Roe v. Wade. But -- and here's the kicker -- they are apparently intentionally using the fact that most politicians are scientifically illiterate to lobby to get the bills to prohibit "abortifacients and contraceptives" as if they were the same thing.

Also in the legislative pipeline: giving pharmacists and other employees of firms that sell contraceptives "ethical choice" to not fill prescriptions for contraceptives, and apparently this right is being extended to whole companies and even to cashiers etc who take an "ethical stand." Of course the countervailing ethical choice for men and women to prevent pregnancy apparently counts for nothing with these theocrats.

All this is going on despite the fact that an ovewhelming majority of Americans -- including those who oppose abortion -- want contraceptives to remain freely available. And this is all going on despite the demonstrated fact that the greatest reductions in abortions have occured in states where contraception and sex education widely available.

People are giving money to these pro-life organizations thinking they are helping to reduce abortions. In fact they are funding a stealth campaign to reimpose patriarchy, invade our privacy, and gain control of the bodies of both men and women according to religious dictates all in the name of turning the clock back as far as possible to 'the good old days before those humanists came along and messed up America's gawdly christian heritage'

-DG

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It leads to a situation with a lot of unemployed matriarchs.

Allen Rice
--- In lpsf-discuss@yahoogroups.com, Derek Jensen <derekj72@...>
wrote:

What's wrong with patriarchy?

>
> >Christendom is in the early phase of counter-attack against

humanism,

> >culturally speaking
>
> Indeed it is!
>
> Free speech & press, freedom of religion, separation of religion

from

> government and all the other values that the cartoon controversy

are all

> about have been resisted tooth and nail by christianity over the

last

> several hundred years.
>
> That we have as much freedom as we do is in large part due to

the efforts

> of, yes, humanists, over the last 400 years who were willing to

demand

> these
> freedoms in the face of overwhelming and very often violent

opposition and

> repression on the part of "Christendom". That they did so even

without

> hope
> for divine reward is something that deserves our jaw-dropped

respect and

> admiration.
>
> I for one do not wish to be ruled according to anyone's gawd-

given holy

> book
> and its self-appointed prophets.
>
> For example, I was at a book reading the other night on "How the
> Pro-Choice
> Movement Saved America" And frankly I was shocked at what the

pro-life

> movement is up to. The latest technique is to introduce laws

into state

> legislatures to ban abortion-inducing pills and other such

devices, in

> anticipation of the forthcoming overturn of Roe v. Wade. But --

and

> here's
> the kicker -- they are apparently intentionally using the fact

that most

> politicians are scientifically illiterate to lobby to get the

bills to

> prohibit "abortifacients and contraceptives" as if they were the

same

> thing.
>
> Also in the legislative pipeline: giving pharmacists and other

employees

> of
> firms that sell contraceptives "ethical choice" to not fill

prescriptions

> for contraceptives, and apparently this right is being extended

to whole

> companies and even to cashiers etc who take an "ethical stand."

Of course

> the countervailing ethical choice for men and women to prevent

pregnancy

> apparently counts for nothing with these theocrats.
>
> All this is going on despite the fact that an ovewhelming

majority of

> Americans -- including those who oppose abortion -- want

contraceptives to

> remain freely available. And this is all going on despite the
> demonstrated
> fact that the greatest reductions in abortions have occured in

states

> where
> contraception and sex education widely available.
>
> People are giving money to these pro-life organizations thinking

they are

> helping to reduce abortions. In fact they are funding a stealth

campaign

> to
> reimpose patriarchy, invade our privacy, and gain control of the

bodies of

> both men and women according to religious dictates all in the

name of

> turning the clock back as far as possible to 'the good old days

before

> those
> humanists came along and messed up America's gawdly christian

heritage'

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Derek,

  Assuming your marriage is a consensual arrangement, I wouldn't call it patriarchy even if you are the one making most of the decisions. Patriarchy, I believe, means *rule* by men, and *rule* means nonconsensual government. You don't think men should be legally granted more political power or rights than women, do you?

Yours in liberty,
        <<< starchild >>>

Oh. My family runs well as a patriarchy. Just don't tell my wife I said that.

It leads to a situation with a lot of unemployed matriarchs.

Allen Rice
--- In lpsf-discuss@yahoogroups.com, Derek Jensen <derekj72@...>
wrote:
>
> What's wrong with patriarchy?
>
> >
> > >Christendom is in the early phase of counter-attack against
humanism,
> > >culturally speaking
> >
> > Indeed it is!
> >
> > Free speech & press, freedom of religion, separation of religion
from
> > government and all the other values that the cartoon controversy
are all
> > about have been resisted tooth and nail by christianity over the
last
> > several hundred years.
> >
> > That we have as much freedom as we do is in large part due to
the efforts
> > of, yes, humanists, over the last 400 years who were willing to
demand
> > these
> > freedoms in the face of overwhelming and very often violent
opposition and
> > repression on the part of "Christendom". That they did so even
without
> > hope
> > for divine reward is something that deserves our jaw-dropped
respect and
> > admiration.
> >
> > I for one do not wish to be ruled according to anyone's gawd-
given holy
> > book
> > and its self-appointed prophets.
> >
> > For example, I was at a book reading the other night on "How the
> > Pro-Choice
> > Movement Saved America" And frankly I was shocked at what the
pro-life
> > movement is up to. The latest technique is to introduce laws
into state
> > legislatures to ban abortion-inducing pills and other such
devices, in
> > anticipation of the forthcoming overturn of Roe v. Wade. But --
and
> > here's
> > the kicker -- they are apparently intentionally using the fact
that most
> > politicians are scientifically illiterate to lobby to get the
bills to
> > prohibit "abortifacients and contraceptives" as if they were the
same
> > thing.
> >
> > Also in the legislative pipeline: giving pharmacists and other
employees
> > of
> > firms that sell contraceptives "ethical choice" to not fill
prescriptions
> > for contraceptives, and apparently this right is being extended
to whole
> > companies and even to cashiers etc who take an "ethical stand."
Of course
> > the countervailing ethical choice for men and women to prevent
pregnancy
> > apparently counts for nothing with these theocrats.
> >
> > All this is going on despite the fact that an ovewhelming
majority of
> > Americans -- including those who oppose abortion -- want
contraceptives to
> > remain freely available. And this is all going on despite the
> > demonstrated
> > fact that the greatest reductions in abortions have occured in
states
> > where
> > contraception and sex education widely available.
> >
> > People are giving money to these pro-life organizations thinking
they are
> > helping to reduce abortions. In fact they are funding a stealth
campaign
> > to
> > reimpose patriarchy, invade our privacy, and gain control of the
bodies of
> > both men and women according to religious dictates all in the
name of
> > turning the clock back as far as possible to 'the good old days
before
> > those
> > humanists came along and messed up America's gawdly christian
heritage'
> >
> > -DG
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
>
> --
> View my blog at http://derekj72.blogspot.com
>

Yahoo! Groups Links

--
View my blog at http://derekj72.blogspot.com

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Dear Starchild;
   
  You wrote and asked Derek:
   
  You don't think men should be legally granted more political power or rights than women, do you? Yours in liberty,
  
    <<< starchild >>>
   
  I have ta ask yah where'd you get that gol dang tarnation notion that wimmin gits tah have legally granted political power or rights? How can wimmin ever understand political power or rights? Why it certainly isn't within their god given duties to know sech thangs... That's stuff for real men.
   
  Like they say about race car drivers: fast cars - fast wimmin and good beer - but not exactly always in that order - if'n yah knows what's for...
   
  Wimmin they're best like a German saying I heard onst: Kinde Kirche Kuche. That's children - church - kitchen. Them german men they'd know what's best for their wimmin. Yep. And that's whut it's all about!!! Fer sure.
   
  Why before you'd knows it you'd get some gol' dang fool woman like that Hilary think'en they'd git to be President of the US!!! A woman as President??? What in the heck is the world comin' tah???
   
  I tells yah - wimmin in politics - nop' ain't gonna happ'n. It jist ain't right!
   
  Ron Getty
  SF Libertarian
   
  Starchild <sfdreamer@...> wrote:
  Derek,

Assuming your marriage is a consensual arrangement, I wouldn't call it
patriarchy even if you are the one making most of the decisions.
Patriarchy, I believe, means *rule* by men, and *rule* means
nonconsensual government. You don't think men should be legally granted
more political power or rights than women, do you?

Yours in liberty,
<<< starchild >>>