Dear All,
On our last LPSF meeting, I volunteered to contact the Libertarian Party of Washington State regarding obtaining their OK to put our name (instead of theirs) in their brochure "The Philosophy of Liberty." I called the telephone numbers on the brochure, and found both disconnected; one number had changed into a "900" number, which my telephone blocks. I cannot find their website www.lpws.org. I do not want to contact other similar websites and send both them and me on a wild goose chase.
A couple of meetings ago, I also volunteered to order 500 Left vs Right brochures from The Liberty Source. Where the website should be the is a notice that their domain name has expired. So no website. I do not see a phone number on the brochure. The brochure is not offered on the LP website.
As an alternative I decided to order from the LP website a brochure similar in nature. My computer security program raised all kinds of warnings, but since I ordered a million times from the LP website before, I ignore the warnings. I should have figured something was wrong when the purchase summary said I had a $326.00 discount, on a purchase of $117.12, but I ignored that also. I knew something was wrong when the e-mail confirmation said I had just paid $24,117.12 to Robin Foster. I called the credit card company, reversed the charge, and closed my credit card. That is the end of my volunteering to order from LP.org.
See you all on Saturday. We can discuss again what to do about distribution literature then.
Marcy
Dearest Marcy;
Just exactly what was the url you attempted to use that vastly over-billed you?
The LP site may very well have been highjacked and if so they need to be
informed.
Ron Getty
Much more likely, from Marcy’s description, that her computer is
compromised. A “man-in-the-middle” pretended to connect her to lp.org
(or more likely) lpstuff.com, and, detecting a commercial transaction,
collected her credit card information.
~Chris
OMG Marcy, that's the craziest Internet purchase experience I've ever heard.
So sorry that happened to you. I'll take a look at both sites and try to
figure out what happened.
Rob
Dear All,
On our last LPSF meeting, I volunteered to contact the Libertarian Party
of Washington State regarding obtaining their OK to put our name (instead of
theirs) in their brochure "The Philosophy of Liberty." I called the
telephone numbers on the brochure, and found both disconnected; one number
had changed into a "900" number, which my telephone blocks. I cannot find
their website www.lpws.org. I do not want to contact other similar websites
and send both them and me on a wild goose chase.
A couple of meetings ago, I also volunteered to order 500 Left vs Right
brochures from The Liberty Source. Where the website should be the is a
notice that their domain name has expired. So no website. I do not see a
phone number on the brochure. The brochure is not offered on the LP website.
As an alternative I decided to order from the LP website a brochure
similar in nature. My computer security program raised all kinds of
warnings, but since I ordered a million times from the LP website before, I
ignore the warnings. I should have figured something was wrong when the
purchase summary said I had a $326.00 discount, on a purchase of $117.12,
but I ignored that also. I knew something was wrong when the e-mail
confirmation said I had just paid $24,117.12 to Robin Foster. I called the
credit card company, reversed the charge, and closed my credit card. That is
the end of my volunteering to order from LP.org.
See you all on Saturday. We can discuss again what to do about
distribution literature then.
Hi Chris,
That's what Bart said also. Of course the McAffee complete scan I ran right after the incident said my computer was in great shape! My life now is in peril form Bart's displeasure, since he told me one million times not to use my work computer for personal on-line stuff.
Marcy
Hi Rob,
Maybe you could kill two birds with one stone, and order the brochures to see if you get a warning from your security program? The brochure I had in mind was similar to the Left vs Right; I cannot remember the name, but it was something like the where do we fit idea.
500 is what I was thinking.
If you find out something, please share it with us. Thank you.
Marcy
Dear Ron,
Better them than me, but I am afraid Bart and Chris might be more right in that my computer is being watched by bad eyes. I go to websites by Googling the name, so wherever Google took me, that's where I was.
Marcy
The LP of Washington website, www.lpwa.org worked fine for me. However,
their Chair, Rachel Hawkridge, has left the LP, so they may be in disarray.
I, too, get the domain expired page for TheLibertySource.com where we
ordered the Left vs Right brochures. In that case, I don't feel one bit bad
about LPSF copying the brochure, since it's not depriving a fellow
Libertarian of income for his work. If that website ever comes back up, we
should order from it, but otherwise I think making a new brochure makes
sense.
I can't tell from lpstuff.com which brochure is like the Left vs Right
brochure, if any. I've requested a low-res PDF of the political puzzle
brochure, and they say I should get that within a day. I'll forward it to
this list if/when it does.
Marcy,
Sounds like maybe you clicked on a link to a site that *looked* like
the LP site, but wasn't! But seriously, they charged you over $24,000
until you had it reversed? What Rob said -- that's insane!
Anyway, the Washington state LP site is www.LPWA.org -- that site
offers the following contact info:
Phone: 206.455.0570 voice mail
206.769.2492 page or SMS
Fax: 302.361.7483
E-mail: chair@LPWA.org - best choice
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
Hi Rob,
Thanks for your help. I misspoke when I said I could not find the lpws website, since what I meant was the lpws I saw did not have the same mailing address, did not have any brochures for distribution, and Rachel's appeal seemed a little desperate. That is why I said I did not want to send them and me into a wild goose chase.
The PDF you ordered was of the brochure I was trying to purchase. It seems similar in intent to the Left vs Right. Thanks for ordering the PDF.
I did not understand which brochure you were OK with copying, the Left vs Right from The Liberty Source, or The Philosophy of Freedom from the Washington State LP? Both now seems parentless, but the Left vs Right might still have copyright?
Marcy
Hi Starchild,
I am hoping that's all that happened; however, I fear that Chris's diagnosis might be more correct, which is not good.
Marcy
Attached is the "Political Puzzle" brochure preview PDF from LPStuff.com.
It is indeed the Left-vs-Right argument made in TheLibertySource.com
brochures we've been using. I'm not thrilled about the layout, but I think
this would do the trick.
Since Marcy has been burned once, I'm willing to order 500 and bring them to
the June meeting (I'll be in Pittsburgh for my professional society
conference this Saturday). If you want them sooner, you'll need someone
else to volunteer to buy them.
Marcy, just let me know what you prefer.
Rob
Rob,
I'm not thrilled with the layout either, or the excessive
nationalism, or the hidden-face Statue of Liberty logo. I like the
Philosophy of Liberty brochure much better for these reasons. But
having some of these around won't hurt I suppose. Of course if you're
volunteering to pay for them yourself, you're free to buy whatever you
want in any case. I do like their updated language comparing the
beliefs of left, right, and libertarians.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
Hi Rob,
Thank you for volunteering to order the LP brochure. They will come under the LPSF budget, as we voted a couple of meetings ago; so keep your receipt, and LPSF will reimburse you. 500 is a good number to order. We will be using these to have on hand and for the Pride booth.
If later we can figure how to order the Philosophy of Freedom brochure, we can order some of that also.
Thank you.
Marcy
The one big drawback of the LPStuff brochure is that everything is
LNC-centric. Most notably, the membership form. Perhaps LPSF could print
up some labels that go to the right of the silhouette Statue of Liberty on
the back panel (center of page 1), covering Join the Libertarian Party, with
LPSF's contact info? I can't think where else we could put something with
LPSF's contact info, other than maybe the very front (right side of page 1),
covering either the flag or the or the ugly new LP logo (but that would have
to be a big label).
Marcy, do you want me to go ahead and place the order, or wait until you've
had a chance to figure out this issue of where to put the LPSF info?
Rob
Oooops, you are right, Rob. We would need to cover the verbiage about the 12 issues of LP News and the address, and that would look tacky. I would suggest not to order.
However, we need a staple, generic brochure for general distribution. We could re-tool the Philosophy of Liberty to show our address. I can live with that although I think that is the least attractive visual presentation I have seen in a long time.
Another alternative, is this image that shows up when you Google "Left vs Right Politics" (I probably just picked up another billion malware for my work computer) something we could just copy? http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:pO2BmOzzjtkJ:www.il.lp.org/images/left_center_right.pdf+"Left+vs+Right+Politics,libertarian&
Thanks.
Marcy
Again, since TheLibertySource.com has apparently ceased operations, I
withdraw my previous objection to making copies of their brochures.
Attached are PDF and JPG copies of the last one of those brochures in my
possession (it has an Outright sticker covering an LPSF sticker with the old
PMB address, but we can use a graphics program to replace that with LPSF's
new address). If this is still the best format/layout that most LPSF
activists can support/tolerate, I suggest just copying it. I'm also
attaching a scan of what this copy looks like when printed in black and
white instead of color. Looks pretty good even in black and white, IMHO.
Yes, I understood that, Rob. The link I gave was the LibertySource brochure; since I did not think of scanning one as you did. I am not thrilled about that brochure in B&W, but can live with it. Why don't we just plan to do that for now?
Marcy
Here's a quick edit to the back page of the brochure to include LPSF's logo,
website, and phone number. Given that we've been burned once by listing the
PMB, I thought maybe this brochure would have more longevity.